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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-20-2019, 10:36 AM Thread Starter
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XTZ Clutch Kit?

So while plowing snow a couple weeks ago the belt on my XTZ started slipping and didn't take long before it wouldn't even move the machine at all. ........... at least that's what I presume has happened. I haven't ever had a belt go before and so I'm not sure......... Yup, I was plowing in low range and most of the use of my machine is in low, however as I was away for a couple days I gave the keys to a nephew to use to run down to the river and do some things and although I had told him to use low range when not on the road........I'm not sure what he may have done, or if it was even caused by his use or not.........

Anyway, I've ordered and just received the AC replacement belt and am wondering now, before I pull it apart if maybe I should be considering a clutch kit for this girl. Do they make a difference in the wear and tear on the belt? Does it improve high range use of the machine? As it is right now I find that off the line in high range is not what I would call exhilarating at all. Quite slow going until she gets moving a bit and then she goes like stink!!

Just some thoughts before I tear into her. Any thoughts and comments would be much appreciated!!!

(We got on Sep 30 over 2ft of snow on the level. And in my yard we had over 4ft in places. It was crazy!!)

2010 Prowler 1000 XTZ Desert Red, hard top, Kolpin split front windshield, rear lexan window, RzR S bucket seats, 28" Swamp Lite tires, MotoAlliance Denali 72" Plow

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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-21-2019, 05:13 AM
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Your clutch should be ok with 28" tires. When you get it apart to check the belt, check to make sure the primary is closing correctly. Look at the rollers, they can bind up. You can re clock the spring in the clutch to get more out of it, to.

'09 650XT H1, 72" Eagle Plow, Warn 3500 Winch. Dyna CDI box, UNI filters, A/C V-bag and console, EPI lift kit, Highlifter springs, Scat ProCar suspension seats. Rick the Rockets A frame and shock bushings. 28x12X14 Raceline Bruisers on Vision rims, on all corners. Cowling heat vents. Factory heat and defrost. RD's custom alternator kit. XTZ hood scoop and front shocks. Monster shock covers, turn signals. OEM glass sport windshield, sliding rear window, and lights, lights and more lights!
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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-21-2019, 09:35 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Bryan View Post
Your clutch should be ok with 28" tires. When you get it apart to check the belt, check to make sure the primary is closing correctly. Look at the rollers, they can bind up. You can re clock the spring in the clutch to get more out of it, to.
Thanks for the input. Not knowing a lot about clutches, your response here gave me some things I could google and I found a tonne of great info on re-clocking the spring, roller sizes and weights and so forth. I didn't quite know what to search for until your post here......... so THANKS!!!!! I'm hoping that I can get some time today to pull it apart to see what's going on....... we will see if the stars align to let me or not!!

2010 Prowler 1000 XTZ Desert Red, hard top, Kolpin split front windshield, rear lexan window, RzR S bucket seats, 28" Swamp Lite tires, MotoAlliance Denali 72" Plow

I go by Paxx but you can call me anything you want......just don't call me late for supper!!
If you can't be good.......Be good at it!!!


http://www.northernliteaerocraft.com/
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-23-2019, 08:34 AM
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Clutch kits are about the best performance upgrade you can make. Several things come to mind, Do you by chance have a leaking oil seal on the clutch housing?
CLUTCH INFO



red rollers = 19 grams = 6000RPM AC # 0823-164
blue rollers = 21 grams = 5500RPM AC # 0823-167
green rollers = 23 grams = 5000RPM AC # 0823-170
white rollers = 25 grams - 4500RPM AC # 3402-483
grey rollers 28 grams - AC # 0823-295
black rollers 33 grams AC # 0823-298

17 gram roller - white - 02/375 - 03+400 - part number: 3402-366
19 gram roller - red - prowler 09+700 - part number: 0823-164
21 gram roller - blue - various H1 engines - part number: 0823-167
23 gram roller - green - Tcat engines - part number: 0823-170
25 gram roller - white - 06+ 500 - part number: 3402-482
25 gram roller - white - 00- 09 500 - part number: 3402-483
28 gram roller - gray - 10/650MP - 11+700mp - 12 WildCat - part number: 0823-295
33 gram roller - black - 10+ Tcat mudpro - part number: 0823-298


These RPM numbers associated with each set of weights is only a close guess. every machine will respond differently depending on altitude, tire size, and power adders. the more power you have, the heavier roller you can run for a faster upshift, and more RPMs. if i were you with that power you have, i would run the reds at the LEAST, and possibly even lighten up a set to get them even lighter. in the dunes to run ballz out, about 17-18 grams is where an H1 motor needs to be, and my stage 2 fixed plate work even helps the shiftout even more. it helps keep the rollers lower in the shiftout range, keeping you in a lower gear longer, but allowing you to build the RPMs you need for power, which allows the engine to rev into the power band, and not upshift too fast and bog the motor down.
__________________
///AIRDAM clutch machining
< Home - Airdam Clutches >

________________________________________
Info.. From Airdam post in one of my thread's

C-1 is 34 degrees of preload on the spring so yeah its a little more than the others here is a graph to show it all to you


with the helix facing upwards, you turn the top movable sheave clockwise, tightening the spring up giving the spring a pre-load to snap the clutch closed.

the A,B,C settings are incremental in 1,2,3,4 hole positions on the helix itself. meaning if you leave the spring in the

B position and put it in the

#1 hole you twist the sheave 16 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#2 hole you twist the sheave 38 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#3 hole you twist the sheave 70 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#4 hole you twist the sheave 92 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe


A position and put it in the

#1 hole you twist the sheave 25 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#2 hole you twist the sheave 58 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#3 hole you twist the sheave 88 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#4 hole you twist the sheave 106 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe (almost impossible to get it around to line up spring is too stiff)


C position and put it in the

#1 hole you twist the sheave 34 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#2 hole you twist the sheave 69 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#3 hole you twist the sheave 93 degrees to line the helix up with the shoe
#4 hole you twist the sheave 120+ degrees to line the helix up with the shoe (couldn't get it around there so i am only guessing)


so every time you go up a hole, you are adding more twist to the spring, increasing the spring rate which gives you a faster and snappier backshift. i wish i had a spring load device that would allow me to clock the spring giving it more twist and compress it at the same time to see the increase in spring rate but i do not have that ability. for anyone who has dealt with their own clutch you will know that B-4 is SUPER hard to twist the sheave around and get lined up to, because it is super hard to reach. you can see by the degree of twist on the spring, you can calculate what rate would give you the correct spring tension you want. obviously B-1 is the softest setting you can have, and they go up from there. i'll try and make a list of the softest setting to the stiffest setting for you guys just curious.


B-1 -- 16 degrees
A-1 -- 25 degrees
C-1 -- 34 degrees
B-2 -- 38 degrees
A-2 -- 58 degrees
C-2 -- 69 degrees
B-3 -- 70 degrees
A-3 -- 88 degrees
B-4 -- 92 degrees
C-3 -- 93 degrees
A-4 -- 106 degrees
C-4 -- 120+ degrees

2009 700EFI XTX, , AC Winch, 2010 Dust Shield EPI Sport Utility Clutch Kit , Street Legal, Cage chopped 2 ", Aluminum Diamond Plate Trim, Relocated Factory Bladders with covers, 5 Pt. Harness installed, Bed Tiedown System, Scat Pro-Car Seats, Secondary Battery installed, Oil Pressure, Oil/CVT Temperature, Volt Meter & Water Temp Gauges installed with Dash Plate, Bighorns, ITP Black 212 Wheels. Tonneau cover. 750 Big Bore Kit, Web Cam, and Rocker Arms.

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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-28-2019, 01:03 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks RD....... That is great info. I found a few posts made by Airdam in my searches and between those and this great post of yours, it gives me something to go forward on. I still haven't got a chance to pull the XTZ into the shop.

i first had to help my spanish son get a shed built to store his families stuff in it before they moved back to Spain, and then onto Germany, for the next several years. We built it from our own design and it turned out great, but it ate up most of 2 weeks for me. Then sending him and sweet wife and daughter off for Madrid.

Second, I had to do a clutch for my grandson on his little Hyundai car. Turned into one of the most intense clutch jobs that I've done, but it is finally done. These young kids (and he doesn't have a dad much in his life to teach him) don't know how to treat a vehicle......well, at least mechanically. He got it into 1st gear and dropped the clutch going pretty fast down tr road and totally shredded the one side of the clutch plate. A nice fine shredded powder inside the clutch housing. But after we got it back together I took him for a drive in it and showed him how to use the clutch with lower gears to slow a car down......... and not burn out a clutch while you're doing it. He was grateful and said he enjoyed the time working with me to replace his clutch.

Anyway, no time to look at the prowler yet, so don't know if there are any leaks yet or not. Hoping things are settling down so that I can get it in the shop. But 1st, my dear Mrs. Paxx's 2015 Corolla has a plugged charcoal canister and it is burping back on her when she tries to fuel up. gotta keep the misses happy.

Will update this when I've gotten a chance to see what's really going on in the prowler.
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2010 Prowler 1000 XTZ Desert Red, hard top, Kolpin split front windshield, rear lexan window, RzR S bucket seats, 28" Swamp Lite tires, MotoAlliance Denali 72" Plow

I go by Paxx but you can call me anything you want......just don't call me late for supper!!
If you can't be good.......Be good at it!!!


http://www.northernliteaerocraft.com/
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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-06-2019, 08:52 AM Thread Starter
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Finally got the chance to get my machine moved into the shop. Interesting thing in making the move. I was expecting to have to pull/push it to get it to move, but i found that if I kept the revs low that it would grab enough to move it somewhat. Just like a car clutch that is worn out, as I would rev it up it would stop moving.

So anyway, I got the cover off and found the belt and sheaves looking 100%. I ran it with the covers off and the variable speed drive was doing it's thing, like it should. So then I put the brake on, put it in high and revved it a bit and the engine did rev but the clutches did not turn, nor did it really even act like it was working at trying to turn things. So then I pulled both the primary and secondary off. One of the rollers n the primary is all gouged up. Is that enough to cause my problems of revving but getting no go through the CVT?

No oil leaking or any moisture inside the housing at all and everything looks good except for the one roller.

I then pulled the inner v-belt housing off and then the wet clutch cover. Everything in there looks good as well.

Soooooo..........will one nicked and gouged clutch roller cause the problem of no drive to the wheels happening? Gonna order new rollers.......going down one weight size to blue (from green) and gonna clock my clutch spring one setting to make things a little snappier at the low speeds. I will lose some top end, but i never use it anyway!!

Thanks for any thoughts on this.
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2010 Prowler 1000 XTZ Desert Red, hard top, Kolpin split front windshield, rear lexan window, RzR S bucket seats, 28" Swamp Lite tires, MotoAlliance Denali 72" Plow

I go by Paxx but you can call me anything you want......just don't call me late for supper!!
If you can't be good.......Be good at it!!!


http://www.northernliteaerocraft.com/

Last edited by Paxx; 11-06-2019 at 09:32 AM.
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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-07-2019, 08:35 AM
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Gouged roller could allow binding in the primary. Primary works strictly off of RPM.

2009 700EFI XTX, , AC Winch, 2010 Dust Shield EPI Sport Utility Clutch Kit , Street Legal, Cage chopped 2 ", Aluminum Diamond Plate Trim, Relocated Factory Bladders with covers, 5 Pt. Harness installed, Bed Tiedown System, Scat Pro-Car Seats, Secondary Battery installed, Oil Pressure, Oil/CVT Temperature, Volt Meter & Water Temp Gauges installed with Dash Plate, Bighorns, ITP Black 212 Wheels. Tonneau cover. 750 Big Bore Kit, Web Cam, and Rocker Arms.

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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-07-2019, 04:58 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks RD........ I figured that it wouldn't be any better with a nice big gouge in it and soooooo ........ I've had a chance to have a better look at things and have ordered a few new parts as a result. On closer inspection the wet clutch pads on the shoes look worn and so I've ordered some new replacement shoes for them. Also ordered all new rollers, going down a weight size to blue. Also gonna clock the spring a bit. Now it is in B,1which RD shows above is 16 deg, and the next stiffer is A1 at 25 deg. That is the one I'll try to start with. Finding what I could about EPI Clutch kits for my machine, it looks like they lighten the rollers and put in a slightly stiffer spring and so I'm hoping to simulate that with what I'm planning on. Also ordered some new clutch nuts, both primary and secondary. Anyway, stuff probably won't get in before this weekend and so 1st of the week I hope to have them in hand. Guess I'll have to do things around the yard instead!!......... sigh!!!!

2010 Prowler 1000 XTZ Desert Red, hard top, Kolpin split front windshield, rear lexan window, RzR S bucket seats, 28" Swamp Lite tires, MotoAlliance Denali 72" Plow

I go by Paxx but you can call me anything you want......just don't call me late for supper!!
If you can't be good.......Be good at it!!!


http://www.northernliteaerocraft.com/
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-08-2019, 12:12 PM
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great info RD as usual , you da man !!

not around much as it [AC] has sat for a year + now , probably going to sell in spring when I get back home from your area. going to pull the fairly new Odyssey battery and trickle it no sense in letting a perfectly good battery going tits up do to my neglect.

off the top of your head is there a drain on the fuel tank ... need to drain and run the system dry for winter storage as it will be outside this winter with a tarp on it. I unloaded my G/N trailer into the garage where it used to park and that's going to take some effort / time to sort through.
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-11-2019, 01:38 PM
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Fairmont 79 -
You have been of great help in the past essential for me in Mexico where I don't have any company support or mechanics. My 2007 650 H1 has had all along a problem with gear shifting, usually shut off engine and then got gears into position. Lately, after replacing some oil seals, cat won't run properly, ordered a new belt, but now I think this is a clutch issue. The rollers on the machine from the factory (second one) has GREEN rollers, not in line with 17 to 18 gram recommended in this post or the blue ones also recommended here! What should I order? My driving is rather lame, mostly on roads.

I always have problems for folks to bring the parts down to Loreto BCS where I keep the cat. I would also like a step by step procedure to change out and install the new clutch rollers, since I'll have to do it myself. If you have not the time to respond, maybe somebody else can help out. Thanks folks!

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